Odds and Ends regarding the CherryOS post
The site wasn't doing very well for awhile there, there's a particularly large boom going on with the Cherry OS post and with it a particularly large wall of traffic that hit.
It's also been updated (and will continue to be) with new evidence and links. It should be fine now in terms of speed, or at least not so slow as to be dead. (do notice the collection plate on your way out, papa needs a new hard drive)
It's worth noting -- because there has been some confusion in my inbox -- that I'm not affiliated with the PearPC project. If you search the blog you'll find some references, including some where I guessed that CherryOS was just PearPC, but there was little real hard data.
I became involved because a developer of PearPC mentioned what was going on to Pieter Van den Abeele of Gentoo Mac OS -- ostensibly about getting Gentoo PPC running on PearPC -- who posted it on his blog, and then contacted me.
My post was done for a few reasons:
- To let the PearPC guys know someone was listening. These guys have been putting in some really good, hard work in compiling evidence.
- The behavior I saw was just wrong. The Mac community is big on semantics right now, but the behavior of Maui X-Stream is both semantically wrong, and wrong in that way that makes your gut twist.
- When I started digging and saw how much hard data was being generated -- that could be verified by myself -- things were obviously out of whack with the tone of what was being reported, but all the data was strewn about dozens of forum posts and other websites.
A casual person couldn't come in and get a birds eye view of just what was going on, nor the history of the project. I wanted (and want) to take it out of the realm of reporters asking CherryOS to respond to vague claims on 'the internets'.
In fact I've recommended that they (PearPC, and the other projects having their code lifted) take the information -- that's still coming in -- and create something like a Wiki. If you know Wiki well, and are willing to help them, email me and I'll put you in touch.
- When you look through the history, the people behind CherryOS have shown a clear pattern of trying to treat the history of their product like an etch-a-sketch.
As an example: At one point the people behind CherryOS did admit that a developer they'd hired had put some PearPC code into it, but that once it'd been discovered by the press the person had been fired and the code removed. Yet they've reiterated now that they never, ever took PearPC code.
Remember, they also claimed this was developed by one guy in four months, so it couldn't be important code... This is just an example, and as I'm sure you're aware their speed claims are pretty much in constant flux..
If I had to place my bets, this is going to degenerate further and they'll attempt to gloss over even more bits of history as 'misunderstandings'. The fact that the software executable they have available for download keeps getting smaller in size as new evidence comes out should really be food for thought.
That just shouldn't be allowed to happen.
Posted by drunkenbatmanMarch 12, 2005, at 06:12 PM
Comments (8)
Posted by: Steven at March 12, 2005 09:31 PM
You presented a convincing case in my opinion. I hope someone will take up PearPC's flag and champion them. Good Reporting.
Posted by: eggsnatcher at March 12, 2005 10:48 PM
Heh, yes I saw your site die while I was trying to read.
It was strange, I've been reading Drunken Blog for months and seen it slashdotted and always thought it was cool how fast you stayed whenever slashdot hit you. My world view will adjust to Drunken Blog not being able to handle a slashdotting. :)
Posted by: Timothy Walsh at March 13, 2005 12:16 AM
'Brutal' is a good term for it, that was a real investigative smack down. I can't wait to hear what their response is... or what happens if the other press really picks it up and asks the hard questions.
Maybe it is just me, but your post almost seemed to be a blueprint for other journalists to start going after them. You aren't that evil, are you? :)
Tim
Posted by: Philip Machanick at March 13, 2005 02:30 AM
A good response would be for someone to post a copy of CherryOS for free download (with health warnings and pointers to PearPC for those who do so) and challenge these clowns to take legal action to stop this.
This would put the onus on them to hire lawyers and show that they had not violated GPL. Whoever was offering the free download would then be in the position of responding to a lawsuit and would have multiple options (stop but someone else starts, get support to contest them ...).
I would do this myself but I could cause offense for generating so much bandwidth ...
The evidence you've presented makes almost as good as case as Apple v. Franklin Apple II ripoff (they actually admitted to copying but were discovered in a similar way).
Posted by: HHH at March 14, 2005 12:37 AM
Morals:
1. If you are going to use someone elses work, especially to charge for it, be respectful and follow the rules
2. Don't lie to your users and the press, it WILL catch up to you. There could be some salvage here if they hadn't lied repeatedly and they could then just go GPL. They are damaged goods now. Anyone searching for "Arben" and "Maui-X" will find this crap. If I had bought their products or invested money in their company I'd be angry.
3. People do care if copyright is violated for profit. It would not be a big deal if they were were giving it away for free. I certainly do not feel the same anger against someone using a warez copy of Microsoft Office as I do if that person is burning CDs and then selling them.
4. Don't piss off drunkenbatman.
Posted by: Ben Donley at March 14, 2005 03:10 AM
It's all just a matter of money. If someone with money to blow wants to take down MXS, they can do it. If not, dunno what's going to stop them. The same guy that originally announced "CherryOS" forever ago has also, in the past, sold modified versions of a GPL product without following the license properly.
Totally forget the product & the project he ripped off, but it was discussed in the slashdot thread a-way back when. The lead dev on the GPL project wasn't American, and wasn't particularly well funded, so he just sent an email inquiring if the CherryOS guy was really doing what it looked like he was doing, and the CherryOS guy did a little foot shuffling, and covered his tracks a little better and quit distributing the product.
Unless the PearPC devs have access to a bankroll, I don't see why it will turn out any different this time. That's probably why he thought he'd get away with it. And he probably will.
Posted by: Ben Donley at March 14, 2005 10:40 AM
And the other reason it's a matter of money is that the MXS guys probably don't have much. So if there were someone with money interested in protecting the PearPC guys, there still wouldn't be much incentive for them.
do notice the collection plate on your way out, papa needs a new hard drive)
i gave $7, should be enough for you to go have a decent drink somewhere. wish it was more, but i'm a student.
speaking of! you are on the harvard cyberlaw wiki. :-)
That just shouldn't be allowed to happen.
hopefully it won't now, for the public shame if anything. you were brutal in tearing them apart. if they were not such assholes i might have felt sorry for them.